If “service efficiency” is relevant to how well VP trains its members, and “service effectiveness/delivery” relates to how well those members do the job they have been trained to do, it seems to me that there is a loss of memory and a big hole in the thinking of the senior VP management presently concerned.
Consider the older methods of training, way back before the rubbish about worrying how efficient the Instructional members of VP and the many public servants doing the training are, in turning out “street police” – what matters is the fact that police turned up to do whatever job was necessary. NOTE THAT – enough police turned up to do whatever work was needed at the point of intersection with the public. There were just about enough trained and operational members to cover the needs of the jobs.
Let’s go back to the training at the Academy about 1970: when I did it, it was twenty straight live-in weeks at the St. Kilda Road Depot. In those 20 weeks, we were SATURATED in POLICE work, behaviour, experiences, laws and structure – nothing else! With the two limited “outsiders” exceptions for Social Studies and Typing instructors, the only people we dealt with were POLICE members, all of whom were senior in rank and experience to us trainees. Nietzsche said, “What doesn’t kill me makes me stronger”, and that was appropriate when the POLICE Depot was active.
We learnt only from POLICE persons, thus we knew and learnt only POLICE behaviours – there were NO outside opinions from biased Government-body “teachers” or other politically-motivated do-gooder opinions to change or challenge proper POLICE learning behaviours and beliefs.
Therefore, POLICE recruits graduating from the Depot acted and thought like POLICE. At the Depot, the Squad Law Instructor was God, and from him, [a carefully-selected and very experienced, properly-trained POLICEMAN], we learnt the LAW and POLICE beliefs, and were examined on our knowledge depth, and breadth of subjects, many times during those twenty hard weeks.
Then we went out, mostly to POLICE Stations, and learnt more the hard way from our superiors in rank and experience, on how to do the job properly. AND in two years’ time, we went back to the Depot to do what was known as RETENTION – many more weeks of POLICE learning, instruction, and knowledge updating, and exams, to make sure we were really doing well enough to be kept on as REAL POLICE, and if we passed, we were confirmed as POLICE!
I would argue strongly that, unlike the “woke” ideas currently used, this idea and system turned out REAL POLICE!
BUT in later years, training moved to Glen Waverley, and the learning system changed a lot.
Firstly, it went over to a program called PCETS or Probationary Constable Extended Training Scheme – that was the start of VP going downhill, because by then, non-police “outsiders” were brought in to “teach” recruits, and thus the POLICE attitude was beginning to be lost!
Members being produced from then on were not really POLICE; mostly they were nice, kind persons trained to help little old ladies across the pedestrian crossing, and to speak politely and kindly to motorists, and were also hatless persons wearing irregular or poor uniform clothing standards who sometimes walked down the street, whilst not looking at anyone! (a euphemism for foot patrol)
Being nice to people was more important than being an actual POLICE member, and operational performance figures, even before the change of this Century, began to show this. The job kept slipping downhill… and has kept on digging downwards since then. It may not have reached the bottom yet!
Hard, efficient work by some police members wanting to be POLICE has plainly been affected, even negated, at all levels since then by poor VP management not biting back. This has allowed interference by Legal persons and the media, and allowed Court rules to prosper fully on the side of offenders.
Hamstrung and frightened police, caused by obstruction, negative mobile phones, and media interference that is everywhere at public demonstrations, have themselves added to the widespread weight dragging current VP members down.
Internal low-grade support from self-aggrandising VP management and gutless operational supervisors has limited and worsened the abilities of operational members. Lowered VP standards of recruitment acceptances, TAFE and other non-police outside study and examinations, external video and phone influencing, TV and print media interference, even writing “Police” on vehicle doors instead of “POLICE”, and political interference affecting police recruits, have all been allowed by senior VP management to drag REAL POLICING down to the low stage VP now is!
Back about the late 1990s, the print media in general, video influencers, TV media and the general public had absolutely no say or effect in POLICE training. A loud and blunt return to those rules and behaviours might just return VP to the way it needs to be to do the policing job properly. Just as it’s taken years for police to dig and slide down to the poor standard VP has now reached, sadly, it will take years to improve and repair, assuming CCP BUSH is left alone to do his job, and that he actually has the capability to renew VP.
No longer is it the once-proud Victoria Police Force – and until it’s repaired, it can only be known as Victoria Police SERVICE!
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Hi John, I graduated from the Academy in 1986. My instructors from all facets were highly motivated REAL police. I find it offensive that you include all members from that area as not being REAL police. I was taught not to take a backward step which I did not in my 34 years of loyal service. I agree with you that Vic Pol is now a disgrace and I am saddened and ashamed that it has become an ineffective political puppet.
This article hits the mark!!!Joined as a police cadet in 1972 and graduated in 1973 and instructors were police and you hung on every word they taught. They had credibility because they had worked the streets and you knew it was genuine. Then working the van with experienced officers who you learnt from in dealing with the various issues and gave confidence in your own ability. All this without speaking to a sub officer, now all gone. The loss of those experienced mentors can never be replaced through fear from command that the experienced are dinosaurs. Policing has not changed only the complexities introduced by successive police command that has changed the true value of what policing is and should be about. Don’t blame the product but the manufacturer and follow up that is flawed.
What a load of garbage for the most John. I was slightly after your time at The Depot and on reflection the twenty weeks could have easily been cut to ten and I have no recollection, thankfully, of being immersed in police culture. I have no idea what you did in your time in the job but I can tell you (and it seems we finished up at about the same time) that I’d be very much struggling to conduct the complicated investigations required of police nowadays or dealing with drug affected madmen who think nothing of trying to kill you in their stolen cars. The job for the main got the job done for a hundred years before our time and will continue to do so a hundred years after we’re gone and forgotten.
How true is that. Allowing outsiders non-police to influence the recruits is a total nonsense. I still remember the stories told by my law instructor. Stories that were the story behind the interpretation of the legislation or the event. Practical stuff. Stuff used every day when common sense was more common.
I am a retired Railway Investigator. I agree totally with the above comments about real police in the 60s, 70s, 80s, and early 90s. We worked extremely well with nearly all police during those years and were headed by a police member for most of those years. I left the railways in 1992 so I cannot comment on the police since then.
Coming from depot training I must agree with most of John’s thoughts. Police seem to be too busy being nice to all to do police work. From personal experience, I reported graffiti on our back fence via the police reporting web site, explained photos were available and have heard nothing up till now two years on. A contact of mine told me a member had been nominated for the job bu they didn’t bother to get in touch or get copies of the photos.
Graffiti REALLY?
Not enough members to man stations, innocent people being flogged, seriously hurt or killed in their houses and on the street.
And you’re complaining about graffiti?
Just thank God no-one entered your house!
Seriously???
John Basham, I admire your courage to pen your thoughts and have them published. I concur with much of what you have said, and I imagine that many others who went through the Depot would, also.
When reading your missal, I could not avoid my recollections of life at the Depot in 1971. The drills and other physical activities were designed to instil some discipline into the psyche of the trainees, and due to the persistence and hard work by our trainers we all managed to survive and joined the Police family five months later. Our law instructor (Sgt John Moore) once said that ‘when you leave here you will have 5000 new mates. He was right.
I was living in South Yarra at the time of my training and was therefore not required to ‘live in’. I was required nonetheless to turn up early each day for my fatigue duties, which for the duration was cleaning up after the Police members working in the carpenter’s shop. (more discipline)
I am saddened in recent times, to note that the public perception of policing has taken a downward trajectory, and service to the community has all but disappeared. (down my way, anyhow). Perhaps the new CCP can rescue that trend.
For what it’s worth I am firmly convinced that the training we undertook, (with its military flavour), was exactly what some of us needed. I look forward to the day when Police once again walk around shopping precincts talking to shopkeepers and members of the public. Foot patrols will in my view, restore confidence and trust with the public. As at this moment many people are frightened to go anywhere for fear of being assaulted or robbed or carjacked. I hasten to add that It’s difficult to catch crooks whilst riding around in a police vehicle with the windows up, and the radio and air conditioner going.
A visible police presence will go a long way to assuaging the fears of those people.
Well done John Basham.
I walked in the door of the Academy on the 30th January, 1979, knowing absolutely nothing about policing. I had only spoke to police maybe three times, twice walking home and once for a speeding ticket. Petrified I was not but absolutely in awe that I had made it this far. The next 20 weeks were, as you explained above, intense and making sure that we were ones who were going out with the same ethos’s, behaviours, understanding as the people who were training us. Minor things like help each other, stick with each others, we are the line, if you get belted then they get belted even harder. My first three months ‘training’ at St Kilda was the eye opener that made me love the job. It was hard, tough, busy, exciting and after about six weeks I was asked to go to early openers with the crew. A large part of was proud that I had been accepted.
On attending retention I recall the ease that I did it in. I had struggled many times at the 20 academy course but retention was easy. The sergeants exams, six papers in six days all hand written and another pass. My board was simple, enter the board where the officers were, asked one question and told to sit down. The chairman’s words made me proud, your supervisors think a lot of you and we agree. Another proud moment.
I had been in the job maybe 19 years when I started to see a decline in ‘trainees’. Why, how and but were words used frequently. Supervisors had, in a very small number of years become mothers, fathers, psychologists, mental health experts because of government policy. Force Command at the time should have stood up and said ‘mental health is not our role, we will assist when necessary where certain permitters are present, other that it is not our role. When solicitors and magistrates started to tell us what we would do to make there task easier, no not our role, we give you relevant paperwork as required, nothing else.
When I did the DVI Controllers Course, Greg Hough said you responsibilities are managing your people doing the actual work, managing the media, managing the politicians, your work is for the families. I remembered this and used it on so many occasions in everyday events.
I do not speak to a lot of past members but when I do they say thank goodness we are out, the media, mobile phones, pathetic and selective management, but mostly the interference by politicians is fundamentally destroying the foundation and basics of modern policing.
Lastly I have been lucky to work under many people who had integrity, honesty, loyalty and cared about the direction of policing today but have been stifled by many things I have mentioned.
Could not agree more. Policing has to return those days when ‘we Learned how to be POLICE.
Having gone through the depot in 1971, Russell St, and retention, I can
concur with John.
We were taught to be Policemen. As a X Cadets we grew up very quickly, and as my other cadet squad mates ( who are all still in contact with me) it turned boys into men.
I’ve been out 30 years now, but even back then as an O/C could see how very different new members were to when we went through.
I really dont think the youth of today could or would handle the training if the 70s.
I agree in part re especially academy based training. A marked difference in outcomes when training in part was outsourced. Only good and solid police members know how to train people to be police. I believe the other perspective or change probably around mid 80s was in the profile of person selected to be Police Officer. Went from mostly tough resilient men to massive numbers of women and young men who were more nice as stated than an actual law enforcer I went from a keen young Connie on the van to dreading coming to work to find I was rostered with another nice person rather than a crook catcher. You would have to be very naive not to know in vic police service is in crises and has trouble looking after itself let alone a public wondering where the protectors have gone. There are more leaving than coming in which if you know your grade 3 maths is a recipe for disaster for us all. My opinion is that it will never return to what it once was and I don’t know where people will be hired from. Maybe AI robo cop will became a reality 🙏👮🏼♀️👮🏻🤔
What an incredibly disrespectful post. According to you, all of the PCETS are pretty much useless. Never mind the VA winners that were PCETS. How about all the PCETS that have kicked on and been a part of some of the states biggest investigations. How about the PCETS that have contributed an incredible amount to road safety and to community safety.
Have you any idea about modern policing? The challenges that are faced by today’s police? The caliber of today’s offenders? The challenges of being faced with today’s protesters? The media scrutiny?
Incredibly disappointing that you would dedicate resources to posting this.
I’ve been in over 30 years and whilst, yes policing has dramatically changed in this time, the vast majority is for the better. No drinks heaps of alcohol culture, vastly better at mental health (still a long way to go though) and treating police women with respect. What has changed, and this is a society thing, young coppers come in to test it out, were as we came in for a career.
I have no doubt there are a lot of “nice” coppers currently serving, as there would no doubt have been in the 1970’s when you left the Depot.
The young ones nowadays need our support, not being bagged.
I am not long out of a supervisory spot in the CBD and I can tell you a decent amount of the young ones that have come through the last few years, proper hard units that just want to catch crooks and more than happy to get in a dust up if needed. I’d work the van with these young ones any day of the week.
Well said!
What crap are you spinning? Back in your day policing was different and the community had RESPECT for officers. This probably made your time easy.
I can picture you at your station with your ‘superman’ attitude who no one wanted to work with. I came across a few and I just knew I was going to have a shit shift in the divy van listening to how good you are.
You really give this platform a bad name.
This back in my day crap is so offensive to me and Ally if other members in this group. I went through the academy in 1992 and was doing fatigues and were taught by coppers except for typing. You are being so disrespectful to so many you should apologize. Not withstanding I do agree that the force has declined since Comrie and co were appointed, but the job has changed as has the world. The 70’s were 50 years ago! Catch up with the real world.
John: thank you for your article, however you are completely off the mark and in some areas wrong.
May I suggest you withdraw the article, research it again and resubmit.
Scott Andrews’ reply has added great depth to this topic and would be a good source to investigate further for its accuracy and currency.
A few extra thoughts;
Many of the best life, education and policing skills (particularly the ones that kept me alive) were taught to me by civilian instructors, not necessarily law or drill instructors in the late 70’s-80’s and beyond.
Any generational decline in training standards has come to us via all CCPs from 1970 to 2026;
The wholesale embracing of “Corporatism” by Vicpol managers has progressively eroded the training and operational fabric of policing whereby people of rank either failed to challenge the erosion, were punished for speaking out, or for money or peace of mind, just stayed silent (and many want that silence to remain well into retirement);
CCP Bush seems to be progressively moving on the supporters and key enablers of corporatism (the good guys/gals and the not so good alike) so that the average troop and supervisor no longer fears coming to work in a busted corporatised workplace;
Due to its make up of very nice, well meaning, long retired members in CAA, I don’t think (some) are in touch with modern policing challenges or ready to acknowledge ‘corporatisms role’ in evolving the horrible mess our wonderful 2026 members battle on with each and every day.
I’m now over 2 years retired after 46 years service across various operational and investigative roles, including roles as a trainer with Vicpol (classroom and on-road) and also with international LEA’s in multiple countries. All that has taught me that we train for the times in which we live, not for the rough and tumble of the past!
I agree with many comments here in relation to John’s article being outdated and a massive generalisation. I went through the Academy in 1990 and spent 35 years in the job. I feel like the training was tough and we certainly were thrown in at the deep end and were all about good old fashioned policing and catching crooks. But times have changed unfortunately and some things have vastly improved such as no longer having one member in the watchouse with a cell full of prisoners as it used to be. Whether or not we like the changes we have to move with them. I w not long retired and glad to be out but I considered myself a decent coppa and worked with many more along the 35 years.
Excellent article John.